Online video streaming: "Is Internet becoming the most powerful force in the European Union?", Ljubljana, 12.11.2010

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Archive of online video streaming: Citizens Forum " Is Internet becoming the most powerful force in the European Union?", Ljubljana, 12.11.2010
Chatbox archive:

Državljanski forum ali postaja internet najvecja moc v EU
  • Torek, 09. november 2010 22:28     Simon Delako     Video streaming of on-line European Parliament Citizen's forum "Is internet becoming the most powerful force in the European Union?" is going to start on Friday, November 12th 2010 at 17.30 (CET). More information about on-line European Parliament Citizen's forum are available here http://evropske-volitve.si/spletni-forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=150
  • Sreda, 10. november 2010 18:37     Simon Delakorda     You are kindly invited to submit your comments and questions to members of the European Parliament Tanja Fajon (S&D/SD) from Slovenia and Christian Engström (Greens-EFA/Pirate Party) from Sweden by using this chat-room. Please follow posting instructions below.
  • Četrtek, 11. november 2010 07:26     Simon Delakorda     Discussion topics: *Free flow of information and services in the European Union and the protection of copyright and patent laws, *The role of the European Union in ensuring the protection of all internet users and *The future of information technologies and new forms of political participation with respect to the functioning and the role of the European Parliament in political life. More information at http://www.evropske-volitve.si/forum/topic.html?f=28&t=150
  • Četrtek, 11. november 2010 09:54     Simon Delakorda     NEW! On-line European Parliament Citizen's forum pamphlet is now available here http://www.evropske-volitve.si/images/stories/datoteke/pamflet_Internet-Citizens-forum-2010.pdf
  • Četrtek, 11. november 2010 18:55     Hans H.     Dear Christian Engström, ("ahoi" as we say in the german pirate party :-) Many people in the creative industries are looking for new business models. They try to find sustainable ways to enable (and to finance) the production of content for newspapers, books, musik, software, etc. I don't expect, that you have the answer ;-) however I would like to hear an estimate from you: In 2030, what will be the shares of old-school licenced content, vs. creative-commons-style content. Or to ask the other way round: How much content will be financed by selling copies and how much content will be financed by other source (sponsors, merchandising, voluntary work, consulting services...)?
  • Četrtek, 11. november 2010 20:25     guest_8025     could you please clarify the question?
  • Četrtek, 11. november 2010 20:27     guest_8025     could you please clarify the question POWERFUL for whom? a. for the businesses b. for the civil society c. for govenrment f. for the policy debate? further. which layer of internt do you mean? email - social media - websites. there is NO INTERNET. thats only a technical layer with various MEDIA build on it. pozdraz iz Beca, Kari
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 09:44     Simon Delakorda     Dear Kari and Hans, thank you very much for your first questions and comments. Feedbacks and answers will be provided during debate starting today at 17.30 (CET). Best regards, Simon
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 11:14     Mateja (moderator)     Hello, my name is Mateja and I will be moderating this chat room.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 12:01     Niklas Ivarsson, Sweden     Do you think ethics and consequences of conduct on the internet should be taught children in school, rather than governments attempting to control the internet?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 12:30     Mateja (moderator)     Dear Niklas Ivarsson, thank you very much for your question.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 12:37     Simon Delakorda     Dear participants, there are also interesting comments published on the European Parliament Facebook http://www.facebook.com/europeanparliament. You can check them and provide your inputs for MEPs here.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:27     Mateja (moderator)     Dear visitors and internet users, welcome to the on-line European Parliament Citizen's forum "Is internet becoming the most powerful force in the European Union?"
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:27     Mateja (moderator)     We are going to start in 5 minutes
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:28     Mateja (moderator)     Speakers and audience are already gathering at this rather historical event :)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:28     Mateja (moderator)     My name is Mateja Grca and I will facilitate this chat room.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:32     Mateja (moderator)     We will start 5 minutes later
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:32     Mateja (moderator)     please excuse us
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:36     Mateja (moderator)     The aim of today's Citizens forum is to publicly discuss about the following crucial EU issues on the political agenda of the European Parliament:
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:37     Mateja (moderator)     1. Issue: Free flow of information and services in the European Union and the protection of copyright and patent laws.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:37     stojko     and hare we go live ... great
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:37     Mateja (moderator)     2. Issue: The role of the European Union in ensuring the protection of all internet users.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:37     Mateja (moderator)     3. Issue: The future of information technologies and new forms of political participation with respect to the functioning and the role of the European Parliament in political life.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:38     Mateja (moderator)     Hello stojko
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:38     Mateja (moderator)     The speakers of today's forum are: Tanja Fajon (S&D/SD), Slovenia and Christian Engström (Greens-EFA/Pirate Party), Sweden, participating via Skype conference
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:38     Mateja (moderator)     The moderator of this forum is Simon Delakorda, Institute for Electronic Participation
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:39     Mateja (moderator)     In case of any technical questions relating to video or voice issues my colleague Matej Delakorda will provide help and assistance.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:39     Mateja (moderator)     These were basic information about this interesting event and of course the main goal of digital Citizens forum is to enable online visitors to voice their opinions and questions to the participating MEPs.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:39     Mateja (moderator)     So you are all cordially invited to submit your comments and questions to members of the European Parliament. It should be quite easy, just enter your name and your question/comment into this chat box bellow.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:40     Mateja (moderator)     Your questions will be directly presented to the MEPs by the moderator Simon Delakorda.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:40     Matija "hook" Š     It would be nice if this was handled by open standards instead of Flash — that way everyone could participate.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:41     Severina     Hello, it works also from home PC ;)))
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:42     Mateja (moderator)     Christian Engström is presenting himself
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:42     Mateja (moderator)     Hello Severina:) We are glad to hear that
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:43     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     picture and voice i relly perfect
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:43     Mateja (moderator)     Tanja Fajon is presenting herself also
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:44     Mateja (moderator)     Now the forum will start with the first topic - Free flow of information and services in the European Union and the protection of copyright and patent laws. The topic will be introduced via EuroparlTV video http://www.europarltv.europa.eu/
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:44     Mateja (moderator)     Both MEPs will provide their positions and you are invited to submit your questions/comments relating to the first topic
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:45     Mateja (moderator)     @Tanja Fajon: Balance is the most important
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:45     Mateja (moderator)     @Stojko - thank you!
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:46     Peter     Do we ask the questions now or do we wait untill the end of the discussion?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:47     Mateja (moderator)     Yes, Peter, you can
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:47     Matija Šuklje     Will there be a recording of this available online?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:48     Mateja (moderator)     Yes, Matija
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:48     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     great
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:48     Matija Šuklje     :)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:48     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     :)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:48     manuel     Hi from Vienna, do we have a twitter hashtag?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:49     Mateja (moderator)     Hello manuel, Matej will answer on your question
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:50     Studio 12 (moderator)     @Manuel: you can use #Cforum (event) and #kiberpipa (location of the event)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:51     Jure Č.     so we're mixing all these different concepts all over the place
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:51     Mateja (moderator)     @Tanja Fajon: the consumer is the one who is responsible
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:52     Mateja (moderator)     @Christian Engström: has different opinion
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:53     Studio 12 (moderator)     @Jure Č: agreed, moderators prefer to use this chat room to have the discussion at one place. But if some wants to use twitter...
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:54     Peter     I have a question for both guests, the EU countries have different opinions on the privacy questions because of the Google StreetView, where Google takes pictures of streets and buildings. Could the EU create a common position on this, so that all citizens are protected or not protected in the same way?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:57     Jure Č.     How do we teach children that they should pay for content, even if from respect for content authors? Does EU have a mid-term strategy around that?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:59     guest_390     In Žalec we can hear and watch your video performance verry well.Best wishes
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 17:59     Matija Šuklje     Just to nit-pick, "stealing IP", is not the same as stealing.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:01     Jure Č.     So .. 'non-commercial' pirating of games should .. be legal?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:02     Jure Č.     sorry .. ignore my last quesiton
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:02     Matija Šuklje     To be blunt, copyright and patents are government-assigned monopolies. How is that compatible with free market, which the EU promotes.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:02     Mateja (moderator)     guest_390: thank you very much
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:02     Mateja (moderator)     Jure Č: ok
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:03     Jure Č.     so your stance is that 'non-commercial' violation of open-source license, should not be punishable?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:04     Mateja (moderator)     Dear Matija, thank you very much for your question/comment. Simon Delakorda will present it to the MEPs
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:05     Mateja (moderator)     Jure, also your question will be presented to the MEPs, thank you one more time
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:07     Mateja (moderator)     @Hans H. : Dear Christian Engström, ("ahoi" as we say in the german pirate party :-) Many people in the creative industries are looking for new business models. They try to find sustainable ways to enable (and to finance) the production of content for newspapers, books, musik, software, etc. I don't expect, that you have the answer ;-) however I would like to hear an estimate from you: In 2030, what will be the shares of old-school licenced content, vs. creative-commons-style content. Or to ask the other way round: How much content will be financed by selling copies and how much content will be financed by other source (sponsors, merchandising, voluntary work, consulting services...)?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:12     Matija Šuklje     BTW, the music industry's main income are not recordings, but merchendise and conerts.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:12     Mateja (moderator)     Now the forum will start with the second topic - The role of the European Union in ensuring the protection of all internet users. The topic will be introduced via EuroparlTV video http://www.europarltv.europa.eu/
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:12     Mateja (moderator)     Both MEPs will provide their positions and you are invited to submit your questions/comments relating to the first topic
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:13     Mateja (moderator)     2. Issue: The role of the European Union in ensuring the protection of all internet users.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:13     Mateja (moderator)     Key question will be how to establish general EU principles underlying rights to protection of personal data, privacy and safety in the online world in order to enhance trust and confidence of internet users.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:15     Mateja (moderator)     @Christian Engström: we need to decide in which direction the copy-rights should be changed
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:16     guest_9777     Why do the European Parliament streaming services still discriminate Linux users. How can this be overcome and migrated towards open, vendor neutral standards?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:16     Jure Č.     Is there historical precedents of any other topic, where having 'fundamental debate' worked as a model for change? (instead of incremental updates)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:16     Mateja (moderator)     @Tanja Fajon: we are at the beginning how to harmonize our states
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:17     guest_6534     @guest_9777: Todays video streaming is provided by Studio 12 - NGO TV from Slovenia - http://www.s12.si/english.html. Not by European Parliament streaming services.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:18     Matija Šuklje     @guest_9777: Ask Cyberpipe how they manage to do it ;)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:19     Mateja (moderator)     Hello guest_9777! hope you are satisfied with answers ...
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:19     Jure Č.     Is there historical precedents of any other topic, where having 'fundamental debate' worked as a model for change? (instead of incremental updates)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:20     Matija Šuklje     Aditionally to broadening the access, you would have less costs if you would use open standards and open formats instead of proprietary solutions.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:21     Jure Č.     Christian wants to have a fundamental debate. Did that ever work?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:22     Matija Šuklje     When changing the copyright and patent legislature, is the EU taking into account how these came to be and in which historical, economical, political and social state they were started or are we just trying to follow the US?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:23     Jure Č.     ok, thanks
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:24     Jure Č.     That was all incremental.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:24     Mateja (moderator)     Matija, Simon Delakorda will present your question the MEPs in a few minutes
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:24     Studio 12 (moderator)     @Matija Šuklje: Good point about usage of open standards. This challenge can be overcomed, but you also need enough time and know-how to make it happen.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:24     Jure Č.     [comment, not a question] How can then pirate party request from EU to make such a fundamental shift overnight?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:27     Mateja (moderator)     Now the forum will start with the third topic - The future of information technologies and new forms of political participation with respect to the functioning and the role of the European Parliament in political life.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:28     Mateja (moderator)     The topic will be introduced via EuroparlTV video http://www.europarltv.europa.eu/
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:28     Mateja (moderator)     Both MEPs will provide their positions and you are invited to submit your questions/comments relating to the first topic
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:28     Matija Šuklje     Studio 12: a) you have some wise people there and b) they know how to figure it out ;) ...the question is more directed towards the EU. Why spent so much money for opening up to the citizens when you're not using the technology that can open the EU to *all* citizens.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:28     Mateja (moderator)     3. Issue: The future of information technologies and new forms of political participation with respect to the functioning and the role of the European Parliament in political life.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:28     Mateja (moderator)     Key question will be how to strengthen citizens’ participation within the European Parliament and how to improve communication of EU issues through new media forms - like interactive social media and web based TV channels - between policy-makers and voters.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:29     Studio 12 (moderator)     @Matija Šuklje: just checking :)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:30     Jure Č.     shouldn't a judge decide case by case whether a specific case merits infringing on person's rights to privacy of communication before the law allows any kind of sanctions to be taken?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:31     Matija Šuklje     @Jure Č.: You're refering to constitutional judges or a lower instance?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:31     Mateja (moderator)     Tanja Fajon is giving her opinion
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:32     Jure Č.     lower instance
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:33     Matija Šuklje     @Jure Č.: You're asking whether we should ask judges to decide on cases before the law in question was actually enacted?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:33     Jure Č.     the means for people to influence or even access the european political process are severely limited, but big business not.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:34     Jure Č.     @Matija: no, we should ask the law to require a judge to decide on such matters and not leave it up to a company's law department to prosecute - as is the case with HADOPI
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:35     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     i would like ask both MEPs to comment this : EU legislation on gaming/betting
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:35     Matija Šuklje     Jure Č.: Oh, OK. Yes, that's how it should be done.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:35     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     wait wait
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:36     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     my mistake
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:36     Mateja (moderator)     Stojko, no question?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:36     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     no
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:36     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     wait i will write it
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:36     Mateja (moderator)     ok ;)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:38     Mateja (moderator)     @Tanja Fajon: we are debating how to bring European politics to citizens
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:39     Mateja (moderator)     Christian Engström is giving his opinion
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:39     Matija Šuklje     After the Lisbon treaty, how much power does the EP actually have now over e.g. ACTA and similar legislation?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:40     Matija Šuklje     (i can ask on mic as well, if desired :P)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:41     Mateja (moderator)     Matija Meršol has an answer
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:43     Mateja (moderator)     Matija, just few minutes
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:43     Matija Šuklje     @Mateja: Sure thing ;)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:46     Samo Novak     Hey Mateja! Trying to follow the debate from the Netherlands, but I keep getting this 'server not found' message :/
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:47     Studio 12 (moderator)     @Samo Novak, try alternative link / server: http://evropske-volitve.si/video-stream-backup
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:48     Mateja (moderator)     Hi, Samo! Hope we will help you now
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:48     jype     I've been involved in a decision in which the interests of individuals and small businesses were directly pitted against interests of big (European, international or even multinational) businesses. It was rather clear that without a very devoted group of people who felt strongly about the legislation, the legislation would have passed and my jobs and hobbies would have become illegal (and big business would be given the power to litigate against anyone they perceive as a threat). A similar legislation was passed later in a different form, but without the political process that stalled the first piece. This reduces, rather than increases, the motivation of anyone without the prospect of making a considerable economic gain to take part in European political processes and thus increases the disparity between the interests of powerful players and individuals seeking to at least retain their liberties.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:49     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     i would like ask both MEPs to comment this : EU legislation on gaming/betting sector is quite strange dont you think. What is your opinion about internet sports betting and what do you think where should EU or members will go in future - towords blocking those sites or opening?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:49     Mateja (moderator)     Thank you stojko and jype
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:51     Mateja (moderator)     Simon Delakorda is just reading your comments and questions
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:54     Mateja (moderator)     Are we rwally transparent? - question from audience
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:54     guest_0709     One very important question: @Tanja Fajon - why did you vote for ACTA when it is mingling piracy and fake products (i.e. fake Nike shoes) together and tries to force legislation where it is actually not needed. The info presented in ACTA has been widely disputed by experts, but why has this not been reflected in your vote?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:55     Mateja (moderator)     guest_0709 thank you
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:55     Mateja (moderator)     Are we really transparent? - question from audience
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:57     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     great answer Tanja-they are just asking about benifits and not other important questions !
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:58     Simon Delakorda     Hello all we have 4 more questions left. I will try to submit them to MEPs.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:58     Matija Šuklje     guest_0709: ACTA brings some even bigger problems. Check la Quadrature du Net and EDRi on that matter.

  • Petek, 12. november 2010 18:58     Jure Č.     Tanja voted against ACTA if my info is correct.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:01     guest_0709     @Matija Šuklje: exactly. it's just that I came in too late to raise all of these concerns. @Jure - she supported ACTA as did all slovenian reps http://www.votewatch.eu/cx_vote_details.php?id_act=456〈=en
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:01     Matija Šuklje     guest_0709: My info as well states that Tanja Fajon signed that ACTA should be more *public* http://www.laquadrature.net/wiki/Written_Declaration_12/2010_signatories_list
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:01     Mateja (moderator)     Final question
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:01     stojko(Slovenia-Kranj)     thx for answer
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:02     Mateja (moderator)     guest_8025 : could you please clarify the question POWERFUL for whom? a. for the businesses b. for the civil society c. for govenrment f. for the policy debate? further. which layer of internt do you mean? email - social media - websites. there is NO INTERNET. thats only a technical layer with various MEDIA build on it. pozdraz iz Beca, Kari
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:03     Matija Šuklje     guest_0709: Hmmm, I didn't see that one.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     Mateja (moderator)     The online Citizens forum is coming to the end, we would like to thank to all participants for following the discussion about the current internet topics on the agenda of the European parliament.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     Matija Šuklje     guest_0709: On further inspection, it seems that this was the same vote. Did you check the content of the document?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     Mateja (moderator)     Thank you also for providing questions and comment by using this chat room. We hope you find it engaging an interesting.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     Mateja (moderator)     We hope to come together at next online Citizens forum.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     guest_0709     yes I did - there were 3 (or 4) votes on (parts of) ACTA in the EP
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:04     guest_0709     and all but one were passed
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:05     Mateja (moderator)     Best regards from Slovenia
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:05     Matija Šuklje     Hmmm, e-mail me the details, will you?
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:05     guest_0709     and how should I do that? :)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:06     Matija Šuklje     guest:0709: Ta e-poštni naslov je zaščiten proti smetenju. Če ga želite videti, omogočite Javascript. (not hard to find)
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:06     Matija Šuklje     I'm off, battery running low.
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:52     Mateja (moderator)     The video of online Citizens forum Online video streaming: "Is Internet becoming the most powerful force in the European Union?" will be published on the Studio 12 web site
  • Petek, 12. november 2010 19:58     Mateja (moderator)     Questions which were not answered during the Citizens forum discussion will be sent to MEPs e-mail addresses. Replies will be published here: http://evropske-volitve.si/forum/topic.html?f=28&t=150
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